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#21 guest

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 04:45 PM

we are not here to show people where to fish where you assumed that brother..specific naming of rivers-exact locations etc is not allowed---if you want to find a place to fish make a friend with a member or get out there and find it..we aren't a provincial website on where to fish...you may have misunderstood what this is?


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#22 guest

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 04:48 PM

sometimes).  All of these spots are listed online when you look up Toronto urban fishing so I don't see why I can't let people know where I'm fishing.  People come to this site to find places to fish, and I don't feel right making it hard for them to gain such public information.

 

the above is not what this site is about...and they probably wouldn't be there in droves if we kept our treasured fishing spots quiet--if you are implored to give people info give them stuff that only affects you--not all other fishing enthusiasts...is all I asaying

 


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#23 416fish

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 05:23 PM

we are not here to show people where to fish where you assumed that brother..specific naming of rivers-exact locations etc is not allowed---if you want to find a place to fish make a friend with a member or get out there and find it..we aren't a provincial website on where to fish...you may have misunderstood what this is?

 

I guess I was mistaken, seems like most of the threads on this section are "where can i fish?" or "where can I catch bass near Toronto" etc.  Maybe someone should delete all these threads as well as this one?  I've read on the forum guidelines it stating not to name rivers and such and that it should be posted in the reports section which doesn't exist (or I just can't find it).  Someone should edit all these threads naming specific fishing spots so no one will know where we are talking about.  All of the spots I've mentioned are talked about and listed in multiple threads within "GTA Urban Shore Fishing".  

 

I was under the impression that not naming rivers was more geared towards steelhead and salmon runs and not letting anyone know what runs were 'on'.  I read that in a thread on this site before but I could be mistaken.  

 

Where are the moderators?  If I violated the guidelines of this forum please delete this thread and account. If not, then fish on!


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#24 DitchWizard

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Posted 31 May 2013 - 05:33 PM

There are not many threads naming specific places. Most are by people who don't know better. Or they are very large well known fisheries.

Remy is totally inline for telling you off.

You said people are often 2 or 3 feet apart? Wanna be bumpin shoulders for chub? Then keep on posting.


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#25 416fish

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Posted 01 June 2013 - 12:55 AM

There are not many threads naming specific places. Most are by people who don't know better. Or they are very large well known fisheries.

Remy is totally inline for telling you off.

You said people are often 2 or 3 feet apart? Wanna be bumpin shoulders for chub? Then keep on posting.

I hear that, I'm not saying he's out of line.  Just pointing out that there are lots of posts and threads about different places, in fact I chose these spots from reading this forum.  I don't have to continue posting if it bothers you guys, I just don't see a problem when these are very well known spots listed everywhere online, it's not like a 'secret' hole that is not public knowledge.  I would respect the secret locations that are not clearly listed on the ministry's urban fishing list.  

 

I don't see a problem with more people fishing, in fact it's great that more and more people are getting into this sport.  We can all share the water and mentor those who do not know better (let them know about regulations, share tips, catch and release, etc.).  If it's a popular spot and it bothers you that so many people are there, you are the experienced angler and should therefore have no problem seeking your own private spots away from the public.  

 

A few people in this thread have already shown an interest in trying these spots out again because of my posts and I think that's great.  The reason I started posting is so other anglers can get excited about trying these urban fishing spots and we can have a conversation about it.  

 

If it makes you guys feel better I can use this list: http://www.mnr.gov.o...L02_165643.html

 

and refer to the spots as "York Region - Location 6"


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#26 guest

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Posted 01 June 2013 - 09:02 AM

No its better to have more people on the rivers. I agree. My bad.
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#27 apz245

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Posted 01 June 2013 - 09:40 PM

There are no rules against posting fishing spots that aren't related to salmon/steelhead, idgi why you're giving him a hard time.

 

I understand its a sensitive topic, and lots of guests read these forums .. but he's not doing anything wrong

 

edit: I actually agree that keeping locations should be kept to PM's because simply most the people reading these forums just come to this site to get spots, but he's obviously new here and not doing anything against the rules, now he knows that people don't like when you post spots, but again, he shouldn't be crucified for not breaking any rules


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#28 DILLIGAF?!

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Posted 01 June 2013 - 09:55 PM

there might be some misunderstandings. it could be that the trout he's referring to was assumed steelhead. the water mentioned holds trout all year round. Maybe mods can close this now or delete it if they deem it was against the rules.


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#29 Dugger

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Posted 01 June 2013 - 11:45 PM

some people actually enjoy that there isn't 2000000 people that fish there maybe you could take your little courtship to the PM world --so that next tim I go to my home river I don't have 200000 fools casting into the waterwith 9 rods each  because we ran an AD on "where is good near milne dam"...frustrating that people still don't get it--why don't you tell me where yuou keep valuables in your house--doesn make sense? neither does giving away the only peace we have in our lives--

 

oh boy, i fully agree here with remyboy.... a certain "media angler" loves pinpointing great spots all over on tv and on the web which brings out every mouth-breathing yahoo, it's a double-edged sword, you wanna share and yet in today's "social media world" it could destroy a spot in more ways than one. In fact it has.

 

What happened to legwork, homework, getting to know anglers and asking questions in the field and here in PM for specifics if they are willing to share?

 

I watched one fishing programme recently where the host and his buddy for the day discussed this issue and both agreed anglers love sharing specific information publicly ie: websites, forums. They seemed to not grasp the dangers involved. It was almost like they were being apologetic for their actions. Well we do to a point like to share. Why do many people photoshop out the background in their posted fish pics? Because THEY did the legwork, THEY put in the hours of fishing and hobnobbing to "crack the code" on a spot.

 

In my opinion the posting of directions to "spots", GPS coordinates to a drop-off etc, the filming of spots with recognizable background features, the online discussion of what bridge abutment to cast to and how and with what lure ( a sponsor's lure of course) is done by "media anglers" for a few reasons, it sells product, it raises website traffic, it brings in email addys, raises numbers on those reading "electronic newsletters", it brings in ratings.... self-promotion with an economic benefit but at what cost? I

 

It is both reprehensible and disgusting as far as I am concerned, a great betrayal to those of us who value these hard-pressed local fisheries and to us working stiffs who did a ton of work finding them and figuring them out.


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#30 416fish

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 01:23 AM

I actually agree that keeping locations should be kept to PM's because simply most the people reading these forums just come to this site to get spots, but he's obviously new here and not doing anything against the rules, now he knows that people don't like when you post spots

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It is both reprehensible and disgusting as far as I am concerned, a great betrayal to those of us who value these hard-pressed local fisheries and to us working stiffs who did a ton of work finding them and figuring them out.

 

 

 

there might be some misunderstandings. it could be that the trout he's referring to was assumed steelhead. the water mentioned holds trout all year round. Maybe mods can close this now or delete it if they deem it was against the rules.

 

 

 

I'm the new guy here so I apologize if I offended some anglers.  I don't really 'know' what the forum etiquette is, as I just read the countless threads on the forum pertaining to specific spots and thought I could contribute to that.  I can refrain from naming spots in the future.  

 

I just didn't see why naming a popular spot to fish and giving anglers of any experience a starting point to catching fish would be a problem.  Increased interest in fishing helps fund our natural resources in the GTA where we purposely stock sport fish to be caught.  Experienced anglers can help mentor the next generation and help create awareness for fishing regulations, catch & release etc.  

 

Natural bodies of water with strictly native fish populations, basically anything outside of the GTA, is a different story.  Honestly, I would never divulge my personal secret spots in the Kawartha's where 5lb smallmouth are a daily occurrence.  So I understand that some of the spots I named might be held dear by a few members so my bad.  

 

Mods can close the thread if they wish, this conversation seems to be getting out of hand.  I don't do politics, I do fishing so fish on people!


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#31 Dugger

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 10:34 AM

no my friend you are taking it wrong.... this post is FANTASTIC! It has been quite an education and a great discussion on the matter. Sure, new people let some stuff slip, no big deal, we all learn fast and understand why it is necessary to watch what we publicly say. That's all cool. It is when experienced anglers, celebrities if you will, post all that detailed info publicly, they do it not to be nice guys, they do it for a multi-layered gain as I described.

 

Seriously, this is a great issue that has arisen from a refreshing case of innocence. We need more public discussion on these touchy topics and you brought that to us, unknowingly on your part, but it's all good. Whether we talk about stock prices or the making of widgets in this public forum, we are literally hundreds and hundreds of individuals with opinions. Things now and then will get heated a bit because we are all so passionate about this crazy "sport". And often in this context the "written word" masks our true emotions. We may sound perturbed when in fact we are not.

 

Consider it a baptism of fire. We look forward to reading your future posts. You sound like you have a lot to contribute as the 2013 season unfolds.

 

Cheers!


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#32 Dugger

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 10:37 AM

"It is both reprehensible and disgusting as far as I am concerned, a great betrayal to those of us who value these hard-pressed local fisheries and to us working stiffs who did a ton of work finding them and figuring them out."

 

This quote by the way is aimed at the "fishing media".... not OFF members be they new here or not.


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#33 DitchWizard

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 03:17 PM

Very well put Dugger! Did you say you were a journalist at one point? Your writing is excellent IMO.


I really enjoy how on here we can so often discuss topics that could be catagorized under controversial in a level headed manner. So often I see discussions other places on touchy subjects digress into personal attacks and slander, I don't see it here as much. we must have a mature crowd around here or something.....


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#34 DILLIGAF?!

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 03:37 PM

we must have a mature crowd around here or something.....

Finally we did...finally...we did.


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#35 Knuguy

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 05:50 PM

I understand the need to be discreet when talking about fishing spots, but surely there must be a limit. If you post that Grenadier pond is a spot for carp, I don't think you are letting any big secret out. Likewise Angus and a few more spots for 'certain other fish'. "Everybody" knows about those spots anyway. 


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#36 Dugger

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 06:47 PM

I understand the need to be discreet when talking about fishing spots, but surely there must be a limit. If you post that Grenadier pond is a spot for carp, I don't think you are letting any big secret out. Likewise Angus and a few more spots for 'certain other fish'. "Everybody" knows about those spots anyway. 

 

Yes, but discretion is the word, if we are to get specific about a body of water (name and all and locations on that body of water) in PUBLIC we have to ask ourselves a few questions first... can this body of water sustain and influx of multiple anglers who "lurk" on this popular site for information and do not contribute? What will the impact be ie: Litter? Possible trespass complications in some areas that leads to total "shut downs"? Can the "fishery" handle the influx if I share this information in PUBLIC and not in PM? Ethically if I break this code and reject the impact(s), will I be disrespecting those who have done the work to find these spots before me, hardworking, ethical anglers who have limited time to enjoy their passion let alone disrespecting the fishery within?

 

Also, let's face it, not everyone is going to run out the door if I scream "HOLY CRAP THE DRUM ARE GOING NUTS!!!!" but if I scream "THE STEELIES ARE SMACKING LIKE CRAZY!!!!".... more eyes will widen, ears will open and phone calls and emails will be made.

 

What is our motivation for revealing this information? On OFF I know the reason is to be helpful to our fellow members, to share some pics and share our success, we all love to read the posts and view fish pics.

 

For those making money from fishing, there is a different motivation on top of those (but i question often if the money-making aspect is the sole motivation).

 

Do not for one second assume that "everyone knows about these spots anyway". They may "know of them but haven't fished them for years or never until they read your information. Or, many many anglers simply do not know about these spots. Many of these "anglers" sit on their fannies and then when they read some specific information, they floor it down to the location, leaving behind a mountain of litter and bad feelings with the locals/regs... the people who care about the fishery.

 

I find the vast majority of anglers who do not contribute here but come here merely to find spots.... well, not the kind of "angler" I want to share with or know or fish with. Sorry but after 38 years on the water, that is my view on that at this point in time.

 

Sure, large bodies of water can handle the "name game" as can very public waterways. My first exposure to this issue was as a kid, I grew up fishing Port Dalhousie in the 70s and 80s. Our little gang fished it daily and i tell you in the 70s there were not very many people down there doing it till the salmon/trout runs picked up speed by 1979.

 

So, I caught a beauty 10 lb. brown and the newspaper published the photo and it mentioned in the photo cutline what I had caught it on. Well, the very next day it was shoulder to shoulder with folks I had never seen before, litter was everywhere and amongst that litter, to my shock and horror, were multiple discarded #3 Mepps packages, the lure I had revealed I caught it on. It was a HUGE lesson for me. HUGE!!!

 

I have also watched the slow painful degradation of the only cold water fishery stream (a delicate little thing) in Niagara because of all the exposure it has received over the years on another forum.

 

So, yes, use discretion in my humble opinion when naming names and use discretion after that with how specific you want to be on location within that location. You can always ask for PM requests too if you are willing to share.

 

And, of course, there are some OFF house rules pertaining to the naming, or not naming as the case may be, of some Great Lake tributaries.

 

Remember, it is YOUR spot too and you have the power to destroy YOUR spot here in this forum.... it could also be MY spot too.

 

Cheers and thanks for listening!


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#37 Rain-bow

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Posted 02 June 2013 - 11:57 PM

When I first started out, I thought fishing spots should be made public for everyone. This quickly changed when I realized that giving away information on locations can be damaging to both the fishery and the outings of other people. This is especially true with salmon and steelhead. Like Dugger says, when you're giving away a spot, you're not just giving away your own spot, you're possibly giving away a spot that other people fish as well (people who actually put in the legwork).


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#38 DILLIGAF?!

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 10:46 AM

When I first started out, I thought fishing spots should be made public for everyone. This quickly changed when I realized that giving away information on locations can be damaging to both the fishery and the outings of other people. This is especially true with salmon and steelhead. Like Dugger says, when you're giving away a spot, you're not just giving away your own spot, you're possibly giving away a spot that other people fish as well (people who actually put in the legwork).

I use to share a lot of spots as well...but the growing number of irresponsible anglers is what killed it. Garbage, cut lines, people respooling and leave old lines, lure packages, lures, broken rods, broken nets (found one and repaired it and still using it up to now) it goes on...actually saw a guy left his gf (screaming contest ensued) and just walked away....sadly no takers.lol.


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#39 Knuguy

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 11:57 AM

.actually saw a guy left his gf (screaming contest ensued) and just walked away....

 

That's taking C & R a bit too far!! :D  ;-)


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#40 buck

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Posted 03 June 2013 - 12:01 PM

actually saw a guy left his gf (screaming contest ensued) and just walked away....sadly no takers.lol.

 

.


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